Lets create the PineCom
Sorry if anyone has already written this, but at the moment I can't read through all these posts.

my first thoughts. I'll elaborate on case use at the bottom.

this device is not really necessary, UNLESS:

1. It was marketed more for large businesses to communicate with each other over the same network over specific wifi protocol. Immediately I think of churches, theaters, stages, conference halls, hotels, casinos, large corporate businesses with multiple areas that need lots of interdepartment comms, etc.
2. It was specifically marketed to work over wifi protocol, NOT channeled RF, which is important for churches, stages, conference halls, etc. I'll elaborate.
3. Has a WIRED AND WIRELESS (bluetooth?) headphone/headset with mic option. Very important, and would help with marketing toward stages.
4. Has front and back cameras.
5. Very low price, and I'll elaborate why on that as well.
6. Touchscreen with touch keyboard would be nice, perhaps with an app created that was similar to discord: "rooms" you can join, instead of "active calls you can make" and a text chat function within those rooms. This would be incredibly useful for stages and theaters.
7. Has a physical push-to-talk button (though optional between push-to-talk or always-on communication)
8. two physical programmable buttons beneath the PTT button. Or maybe three programmable buttons, and you can program one to be a PTT in whatever app you use, if you choose to.
9. LED light with an easy-to-access control. Dimmable too, if you can swing it.
10. Dimmable face.

I used to work in churches, stage production, etc. We tried to get on a communication device system where we could whisper to each other over a lav mic/in-ear headphone like the classic secret agent thing. The devices were over RF channels, and not wifi. They were extremely cumbersome to use because they would never stay on the correct channel, would lose touch with our antennae, and would interfere with our stage microphones and in-ear monitors for the stage act. Part of that is user error of course, but for the most part we had to work with the faults of the building we were in and the limitations of the equipment.

WHY THIS COULD HAVE SAVED OUR BUTTS MULTIPLE TIMES:
(Because I'm feeling narrative this morning)

It's 5 minutes until showtime. I feel my pocket vibrate and pull out my trusty little secret agent communicator. I look on the face and see a chat to us from our stage manager. "REMINDER: INTRODUCTION AT 8:15, SHOWTIME AT 8:30" Puzzled, I push my PTT button, and all who are in our STAGE TEAM chatroom hear my voice in their ears. "Where is the speaker?" A few seconds pass before a short response. "He's on his way back now." A few minutes go by before "one minute" comes from the manager. All is quiet as the lights dim and the show begins. The speaker walks onstage and gives his opening remarks, and in silence, the players enter the stage one by one. Lines are delivered flawlessly... Except from one who's voice falls on deaf ears. "Mand, check Rachael's mic pack." I can't respond by voice in the quiet, so I push my programmable button 1 which sends a green light to the chatroom, signaling my acknowledgment. between lines, she wafts herself offstage where I can diagnose the issue in private. Mic cable unplugged, and it's likely that this gaudy costume was to blame. I amend the problem and Rachael returns to the stage, just in time to deliver her crackshot retort, loud and clear. I pull out the communicator and write a quick note, informing the manager of the problem. She will talk to the costume designer after the show. Ryan's dry voice can be heard over the comm. "Already breaking things?" I push my programmable button 2, signaling a red light in chat.

Another stage tech enters backstage, his communicator out and LED light active. He is using his front-facing camera to show an equipment configuration to some techs in front-of house through the chatroom, and probably sending some pics of readouts. Probably diagnosing another technical issue quickly and efficiently, and the best part is that all these communicators are standard, have NO mothership antennae or other system to route through, were easy to set up and get assigned into chat groups once on the same wifi, and were way cheaper, more robust and had vastly more functions and features than pro transmitter/receiver setups for our modest budget.

fin

Thank you, thank you.

(EDIT: just to be clear on the physical buttons thing, for certain things like PTT or programmable buttons, I DO NOT always want to be fiddling with opening a touchscreen to do things. If the phone is clipped to my belt and someone needs a quick answer, pressing a physical button without needing to look or unclip it from my belt or even remove it from my pocket would be stellar. Same with programmable buttons on the side.)

But really, situations like that DO happen, and it is an incredible pain when your communication systems are not functioning or maybe nonexistent and you have to CALL each other... which is a huge problem. Maybe a huge operation which has the budget for a perfect system setup won't have that problem, but for smaller venues, churches, production teams, etc... this could be a cheap, quick and easy fix. Best part is, you can set up your own private wifis at a show and bring the routers with you as part of your stage setup if you chose so you don't have to worry about clientside wifi. Or if you're part of a team in a stationary building, you're using existing wifi networks. Hell, you can even get into your "group" from home wifi if you wanted for zoom-like meetings.

I was running this with my wife just now and she said nursing homes use things like that as well, so there are a lot of uses for them in diverse industry sectors. Hospitals, doctor offices, schools, IT companies, you name it. And if you don't design something like this, I probably will to be honest, if not just for myself and my own teams. People have mentioned cameras for scanning QR codes, etc. I think a lot of people who have said "It's not useful unless it has a modem" or "just make a phone" are most likely not in, nor have ever been, in an industry where walkie-talkies and quick back-and-forth comms over distance were useful. And in the case of a PineCom, you could do so much more than just voice.

I think this thing could be huge for teams, venues, etc where they could buy a bunch, have them tagged and handled, and when you show up to work you just grab yours from the box and you're ready to go for the day. When you leave for the day you plug it in so it's ready for tomorrow, or take it home depending on company rules. If you leave the company they just assign it to a new employee. For individuals or environments where that constant team distance communication is not really useful or necessary, it's probably useless, and that's fine, it's not for them.

Hope this helped.

PS I wouldn't be upset if you called it the MandPack. no reason though... just saying.
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Heart 
I'd probably use this device as a companion for a dumb phone, sometimes sharing its broadband. The smaller screen makes it very interesting to me.



Quote: Do we need both a front and back camera on the PineCom? In fact, do we need any cameras at all?

I would like one camera at least for reading 1D/2D barcodes.

I'd prioritize CCD quality
over pixels.
One good camera is much better than two ~useless ones.


Quote:Should we bring over all sensors present on the PinePhone? If so, which do you think we can do without?

I would do without ambient light, gyroscope, compass. They are just nice to have.


Quote:Should we use the same single band/11n/BT4 WiFi module in the PinePhone (for compatibility sake) or change it out for a dual band/11ac/BT5?

As WiFi would be primary connectivity, it would be quite important for me
(so with 5 GHz)



Quote:Should the device feature a GPS (and compass) or are those features redundant in this type of device? 

Not sure about compass, but GPS, please! I want to do offline navigation. Please make sure the reception quality is quite good.





Quote:Should we include SPI flash?

Nice that you ask, actually for me all internal storage makes things more complicated for no good reason. Just do everything from µSD. Easier to tinker, easier to backup, simpler design.






Quote:We’re currently thinking of using a 5” LCD panel for the PineCom; what do you think about this - is there a reason to go bigger or smaller?



It should fit easily on most pockets and not suffer when bending. 5" is probably still a bit big, but fine. The last device I really enjoyed having around was with a 4.3" display.
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It does seem the LoRaWAN ideas are taking off Big Time.!

But, 1) it looks like this new system has packet size limits on data transfer.
and
2) The Big Players in the game are already mapping and claiming the areas where they will be "$elling you $ervice"

I was hoping that these would be more of a modern day high tech "Walkie Talkies"
Buy a pair or more, and be able to have conversations between these units.
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@Luke 
Did this project get scrapped ?
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(07-26-2021, 01:34 AM)bcnaz Wrote: It does seem the LoRaWAN ideas are taking off Big Time.!

But, 1) it looks like this new system has packet size limits on data transfer.
and
  2) The Big Players in the game are already mapping and claiming the areas where they will be "$elling you $ervice"

I was hoping that these would be more of a modern day high tech "Walkie Talkies"
  Buy a pair or more,  and be able to have conversations between these units.

As long as it's legal I certainly plan on running a free base station out of my apartment near DC. I doubt I'd even notice the bandwidth usage on my connection.
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(08-16-2021, 07:52 PM)bcnaz Wrote: @Luke 
Did this project get scrapped ?

Looks like the PineNote got to the front of the queue, after all this talk I'd imagine some ideas are being tested and in the monthly update there have been numerous references to LoRa dev/test so unless those are just going to possible future pinephones with adapters, guessing it's still in the works.
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I encourage people to look up the Precursor device by Bunnie et all (betrusted.io), as it is almost exactly the pinecom, but even more comprehensively designed from scratch for security purposes. The first iteration is scheduled to ship at the end of 2021.

GPS should be included, it is not a large security issue as it is a one way communication.
One camera, enough to scan QR codes for 2fa.

Like the Precursor, I think that the pinecom does not need a large screen, and similarly should also pursue a black and white low power screen, either a memory-lcd like the Precursor, or an epaper display, both of which come in small form factors. 

Ideally the device should be compatible with a hardware keyboard. The new pinenote keyboard seems perfect, though I have not used it yet. If, due to differences in dimensions, it would not be designed to work with the pinenote peripherals, something simple like the precursor or a blackberry would be nice, like this tiny tactile mechanical switch keyboard the size of a credit card: https://www.40percent.club/2020/11/feegle-xs.html                                

With a low-power screen and a good touch typing keyboard, a device like this could be an awesome private note taking device, and an ereader.

The perfect pine64 device for me would be an epaper pinephone with pinephone keyboard.
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Hello everybody,
This is my first post on PINE's forums. I'm in my EECE degree's senior year, and am working on a project proposal for, essentially, the PineCom in backpack form.

I am going through this thread and using a lot of the ideas and suggestions by you fine folks. As others have pointed out, there is a really wide spectrum of ideas about what this device should do. I have to narrow the field significantly, which is something I can do on my own - but I am really excited to engage with the Pine community. I plan on making my project files entirely open source (obviously this won't apply to some vender-supplied chips, e.g. the LoRa module itself, much as with the PinePhone).

The thing about a good senior project is, it can't be only for its own sake. It has to meet the needs of a target audience. The audience I want to target is both professional and recreational outdoors users who need long-distance off grid communications. It's not intended to be a playground for hardware, but a rugged and practical upgrade to your PinePhone.

The core of the project will be the LoRa chip, an external antenna, and an R Pi Pico microprocessor to control the chip. The best additional features to include are still under consideration. I've identified a high-end GPS, a solar panel+battery combo, or other sensors (barometric pressure, temp, humidity, etc.) as the most useful potential additions for that target audience of outdoor first responders and recreational campers, hikers, adventurers, etc.

I have only read six pages of this thread so far, but I really appreciate everyone's input. I hope this project can guide the development of the PineCom proper (I have another name picked out for my project...). I will read the rest of the thread this weekend.
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(10-15-2021, 03:59 PM)krisradio Wrote: Hello everybody,
This is my first post on PINE's forums. I'm in my EECE degree's senior year, and am working on a project proposal for, essentially, the PineCom in backpack form.

I am going through this thread and using a lot of the ideas and suggestions by you fine folks. As others have pointed out, there is a really wide spectrum of ideas about what this device should do. I have to narrow the field significantly, which is something I can do on my own - but I am really excited to engage with the Pine community. I plan on making my project files entirely open source (obviously this won't apply to some vender-supplied chips, e.g. the LoRa module itself, much as with the PinePhone).

The thing about a good senior project is, it can't be only for its own sake. It has to meet the needs of a target audience. The audience I want to target is both professional and recreational outdoors users who need long-distance off grid communications. It's not intended to be a playground for hardware, but a rugged and practical upgrade to your PinePhone.

The core of the project will be the LoRa chip, an external antenna, and an R Pi Pico microprocessor to control the chip. The best additional features to include are still under consideration. I've identified a high-end GPS, a solar panel+battery combo, or other sensors (barometric pressure, temp, humidity, etc.) as the most useful potential additions for that target audience of outdoor first responders and recreational campers, hikers, adventurers, etc.

I have only read six pages of this thread so far, but I really appreciate everyone's input. I hope this project can guide the development of the PineCom proper (I have another name picked out for my project...). I will read the rest of the thread this weekend.

Check on the PineDio STACK project which will be release soon. You can know more about PineDio LoRa STACK from Lup Yuen's tweet.
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Thanks for sharing that!
I was looking at article Lup Yen's Pine Dio page at: https://lupyuen.github.io/articles/pinedio, but didn't notice that LoRa had been tested until you pointed it out.

RISC-V is a really intriguing instruction set to me, but I'm more familiar with the Cortex family (M4 specifically, but M0 fits inside that body of knowledge, so it should be easy to adapt). I am really attached to the idea of building a backpack for the PinePhone to allow off-grid communications. It's not another IoT sensor project, more of a text-based walkie-talkie. Of course, Lup Yen's work on the Pine Dio is really inspirational (wow! so many pictures! hand drawn waveforms! that's awesome!!), but I don't want to switch to the Pine Dio platform.

Would you imagine it's possible to communicate directly to the LoRa module through the 6 PoGo pins on the back of the PinePhone? It seems, to me, like a processor on the backpack would be required to manage the LoRa, but if it can be directly connected via PoGo and controlled on PinePhone software, that saves a lot of trouble.

Thanks for checking out my idea and pointing me towards those great resources!
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