Lets create the PineCom

[KC9UDX]

@nyxxenator I've typed this reply three times but the mult-level quoting apparently keeps deleting my text.

It seems that you have bought different phones than me. I've only bought cheap used phones that aren't ones that other people want. This is probably why they're small and light.

I'm not trying to be antagonistic. But it seems to me that the market must be flooded with devices that will do what you're asking for less money than the cost of a small production run device that also requires an operating system and updates.

[bcnaz]

Does anyone a rough estimate on the range  of this "Pine Com"  device ?
            Will this have the possibility of being compatible with a rf output amplifier ?

    Is this actually a next generation communication device ?  or just a fancy version of an old $5 AM walkie talkie..?

Will I be able to go 75 miles from nearest cell tower and still communicate with someone  ?

---

---

I did not see Luke state any 'base functions'   ( He asks 'what options' would you like )

Will this device actually communicate farther than from one end of the house to the other end ?

Will you really need a GPS to find directions to get from your bedroom to your bathroom.?

I see hundreds of comments of things to add to this device,  but no real description of the base device.

Also,  perhaps these should be sold in pairs or more,  or who will you call at the other end  ?

[tlengyel]

I second the idea of having RX/TX SDR in there.

Couldn't all those other radio functions be accomplished with a single SDR?
Maybe have two SDRs if more that one style of connection is necessary at the same time.

This would, of course, necessitate pre-fab SDR apps that would make the radio be wifi, lora, etc.

[nas]

Does anyone a rough estimate on the range  of this "Pine Com"  device ?

Quick search says lora can do upto 13 miles with a line of a sight connection and about a mile in urban environments. I guess output power, antenna size and whether you're standing  on the roof would all be factors.

I second the idea of having RX/TX SDR in there.

It does seem to be a cool option to explore but I wonder if it's feasible on-the-go rather than hooked up to a fixed setup at home.

[KC9UDX]

Sounds very optimistic, not unlike FRS "ranges".

[TuxThePenguin]

> Do we need both a front and back camera on the PineCom? In fact, do we need any cameras at all?
Cameras would be appreciated since they're pretty useful for a lot of things

> Should we bring over all sensors present on the PinePhone? If so, which do you think we can do without?
Keep the accelerometer and light sensor, maybe make the rest optional through some form of external modules?

> Should we use the same single band/11n/BT4 WiFi module in the PinePhone (for compatibility sake) or change it out for a dual band/11ac/BT5?
Since the device is relying more heavily on WiFi/BT I feel like 5ghz would be a good idea, especially given that many places (especially large networks like in companies) are phasing out 2.4ghz support

> Should the device feature a GPS (and compass) or are those features redundant in this type of device?
I think a GPS would be a good idea but only if it's relatively cheap

> We’re currently thinking of using a 5” LCD panel for the PineCom; what do you think about this - is there a reason to go bigger or smaller?
I feel like using the same size LCD as the Pinephone would be good for consistency within distros as well as allowing it to use the same peripherals like the Pinephone keyboard whenever that comes out

[MotoFufu9k]

1. Do we need both a front and back camera on the PineCom? In fact, do we need any cameras at all? 

I feel like a device that is aimed at communication should have an inside camera for stuff like video calls. An outside camera is always extremely useful for taking pictures.

3. Should we use the same single band/11n/BT4 WiFi module in the PinePhone (for compatibility sake) or change it out for a dual band/11ac/BT5?

Personally I would like that hardware upgrade if it is not too much trouble.

4. Should the device feature a GPS (and compass) or are those features redundant in this type of device? 

GPS is always extremely useful for navigation. If we are imagining people using this for alternative long range communication, there is good chances they will want to use it somewhere where there is no mobile service. A backup navigational system could provide incredibly useful.
Obviously the device could just generally double as navigational system for a car for example.

5. We’re currently thinking of using a 5” LCD panel for the PineCom; what do you think about this - is there a reason to go bigger or smaller? 

I would opt for something smaller like 4,7" or lower. Getting the device width to 67mm or lower makes it actually usable with one hand without shifting it around.

[keg0death]

1. Do we need both a front and back camera on the PineCom? In fact, do we need any cameras at all?
   Personally, I wouldn't mind going with 0 cameras. One rear facing camera would be acceptable, but this device isn't meant to replace a phone. I've never seen the appeal of a front facing camera anyway.
2. Should we bring over all sensors present on the PinePhone? If so, which do you think we can do without?
   I'm fine with all the sensors currently on the PinePhone, screen rotation is also a nearly pointless feature to me as long as whatever I am looking at can be properly scaled vertically.
3. Should we use the same single band/11n/BT4 WiFi module in the PinePhone (for compatibility sake) or change it out for a dual band/11ac/BT5?
   I'd always love more robust connections, but if it jacks up the price too much it isn't necessary.
4. Should the device feature a GPS (and compass) or are those features redundant in this type of device?
   I may be a small use case, but if the device has wifi then I have no need for a phone. A GPS would actually be a nice addition since I would only be carrying this device.
5. Should we include SPI flash?
   I could live without it.
6. We are currently considering following the PinePhone’s general design and aesthetic for the PineCom, but if there is some sort of physical (within reason - also financially) that you think would fit this type of device well then make sure to let us know.
   I mean, if it is going to look like a small PinePhone, then why not make a PinePhoneLite? I would like a device with some honest to god buttons on it, like an old BlackBerry with full keyboard. Someone posted a link to a device called a Precursor, I do not know the specs of it, but something like that device with the physical size of the PinePhone would be absolutely fantastic.A 1/3rd of the front could house the keyboard and whatever size screen could be comfortably fit in the other 2/3rd. It isn't meant to completely replace a phone so the screen doesn't have to be massive. You could do me a huge favor and not even have it touch capable. I know I am in an extreme minority, but touchscreens have been the bane of my existence.
7. We’re currently thinking of using a 5” LCD panel for the PineCom; what do you think about this - is there a reason to go bigger or smaller?
   I went into this a bit in #6. But it sounds like this is going to be a smaller PinePhone sans modem. Using my work iPhone as an example since it is in front of me. The keyboard is usually up all the time, taking up the lower section of the screen. This gives me an effective viewing window of about 4", more than enough screen to see messages, contact lists and terminal windows. My watch's tiny face can give me plenty enough information to be useful as a map+GPS, so I know a 3.5-4" screen would be fine.So a direct answer would be about 3.5"-4"A shorter device but thicker than an average phone wouldn't hurt either (3.5"ish screen size). Stuff a few I/O ports into it and I wouldn't even know what to do with myself, a USB-A and 3.5mm jack would put me over the moon. It may open up cheaper options for parts as well, but that is me spitballing about something I know nothing about.My use cases for this device would be text messaging, note taking, terminal manipulation, emails, music player and rarely a youtube video or two. Given a USB-A port, I wouldn't even need to carry a laptop around. That would be nice, and I hope it is taken into consideration. 

[nas]

Here is another lora device in development. I assume the lorawan standard is cross-compatibile across different devices? I wonder if there is something like a wifi access point map available online somewhere.

[KiteX3]

I genuinely don't understand the purpose of this device as conceived, beyond what could simply be achieved with a LoRa accessory for a pinephone, but perhaps that is due either to my own shortsightedness or the device simply isn't designed for me.

I think it is rather *close* to a use-case I would be very interested in, however. In particular, if this device were stripped down to a much simpler version, with fewer components to power and were (perhaps optionally) equipped with an e-ink display, to absolutely maximize battery life, I could see a tremendous range of applications for it; it could be an alternative to an e-ink Kindle, or it could serve as a digital calendar to hang on the wall, fed data to display by a phone or home server. Perhaps it could serve as an interface to a home automation system! Or, equipped with an SD card, it could serve as a minimalistic home server itself. If it's green enough, you might even be able to power it with solar panel accessories alone. Even if it only ran a virtual consoles (i.e. no X, Wayland, etc), I could find a wide range of uses for that.

Perhaps that would transform it into an entirely different device than what you're intending, but as for what has been suggested, it seems to currently be beyond my own interests.