(08-28-2017, 05:45 AM)z4v4l Wrote: sales decline. of course they cannot always grow. it's saturation. i understand PC vendors want them to always grow, but I don't understand how they could not see it cannot always grow. For example I am using PC with CPU from 2002! xD I am not going to buy a new PC every year. This doesn't mean I am not sitting in front of a PC like ~10 hours everyday. this decline of sales is a sign of market saturation and not even close to "PC disappearance".

Quote:I use a full sized keyboard every day, and a large screen too ( three of them ) but they are all SBC ( Arm ) driven ( RPi , PineA64, and Rock64 ).

that's it. you still use PCs. these tiny arm boards are mini-PCs and I love their power efficiency, I am dreaming of desktops fully fanless in the future.
So no, PCs don't disappear, and my point was that Windows support for arm would make the latter a way into this sub-range - little fanless power efficient PCs. The next generation of Pinebook would be "just an ordinary laptop", which would mean its sale numbers would be several magnitudes larger than nowadays.

Quote:Of course I've not used Windows of any flavor since 1998 ( professionally and personally ).

That's hardcore. I am opposite - Windows is my favorite OS. Because of it I got to love system programming and now am messing around these SBCs trying to create UEFI for them.

(08-31-2017, 07:22 AM)z4v4l Wrote: I am not as experienced too, and my use case is on the other end from yours (i am trying to do my hobby OS/FW stuff on these borads), but I guess It's early for arm boards to provide audio/video editing capabilities. As I understand, these require powerful workstations. Maybe some Nvidia (pricey) things like Jetson.

(08-31-2017, 06:41 PM)dcmorley Wrote:

(08-31-2017, 07:22 AM)z4v4l Wrote: I am not as experienced too, and my use case is on the other end from yours (i am trying to do my hobby OS/FW stuff on these borads), but I guess It's early for arm boards to provide audio/video editing capabilities. As I understand, these require powerful workstations. Maybe some Nvidia (pricey) things like Jetson.

I've been using an i7 build I did a few years ago, now with the release of the Coffee Lake series I'm considering doing a new build to reduce render time. I'm using my Pine64 more like a Bad Ass tablet with way more functionality. I jump from Ubuntu to Android and back with the PlayBox.

(09-01-2017, 03:47 PM)dkryder Wrote:

(08-31-2017, 06:41 PM)dcmorley Wrote:

(08-31-2017, 07:22 AM)z4v4l Wrote: I am not as experienced too, and my use case is on the other end from yours (i am trying to do my hobby OS/FW stuff on these borads), but I guess It's early for arm boards to provide audio/video editing capabilities. As I understand, these require powerful workstations. Maybe some Nvidia (pricey) things like Jetson.

I've been using an i7 build I did a few years ago, now with the release of the Coffee Lake series I'm considering doing a new build to reduce render time. I'm using my Pine64 more like a Bad Ass tablet with way more functionality. I jump from Ubuntu to Android and back with the PlayBox.

this is a nice nvidia dev board for the price. since release of tx2 , they have dropped tx1 board from $599 to $199. (this particular board does not have onboard camera of the original board)  http://www.nvidia.com/object/JetsonTX1DeveloperKitSE.html

(08-27-2017, 08:08 AM)MarkHaysHarris777 Wrote:

(08-27-2017, 06:06 AM)z4v4l Wrote: For me it is of a great interest, I always said if MS released Windows for arm as an open platform as with x86, it would be a bomb. Arm finally could enter a real competition with Intel. <snip>

I disagree.  Arm and Intel serve two completely different markets , and have two completely different purposes.

Microsoft and the "Windows" brand are becoming irrelevant, generally.  This is no more true than in the embedded world of Arm.  Redmond doesn't control Arm;  Arm controls Arm.  The difference is that Windows is a platform ; Arm is a specification which is implemented by a plethora of vendors.  To fully understand Arm, you need to unlearn almost everything you think you understand about personal computers!  

Arm is not in competition with Intel;  in fact, Arm does not compete as such.  PC(s) are finally going the way of the typewriter. What we think of as a personal computer has morphed into embedded mobile devices which the PC market place, locked down my Redmond, did not anticipate ( at least not soon enough ).

Nobody really thought about a time when ( generally ) people would not turn on PC(s) any longer;  but would rely on embedded systems and tiny mobile devices;  for some of us ( who still need a full sized keyboard and a very large screen ) the embedded world is able to fill the need quite well indeed.  I still have a large screen on my desk, and a full sized keyboard,  but a tiny SBC drives all of it!

I'm even using my notebooks ( mostly x86 ) less ;  large clunky heavy devices that get hot and have only 1.5-2.0 hours of batt life if I'm lucky.  My least expensive one was $400 usd.  I'm now using a $99 dollar notebook driven by Arm ( Allwinner SoC ) which in contrast is very lite weight, runs cool, and at last cycle got 9.3 hours on one battery charge !

And did I mention the silly thing is fast;  I mean really, screaming fast.

   Arm

(09-02-2017, 01:15 PM)dkryder Wrote: recent news of another brand that has finally reached death throes status [for real]
https://developers.slashdot.org/story/17/09/01/1326253/oracle-finally-decides-to-stop-prolonging-the-inevitable-begins-hardware-layoffs
this one was long and painful. sparc is dead. long live sparc.     sparc