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+--- Thread: Future plans for hardware (/showthread.php?tid=10581)
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Future plans for hardware - daniel_mazurkiewicz - 07-06-2020
In terms of hardware PinePhone is already outdated to nowadays standards. Wondering if and what are exactly the future plans to keep it somewhere closer to modern standards in terms of hardware performance, screen type and resolution, or cameras?
Ps. Secondary and possibly third USB-C port could have a huge advantage over other phones on the market, has anyone thought of it?
RE: Future plans for hardware - wibble - 07-07-2020
Mostly covered in this thread I think:
https://forum.pine64.org/showthread.php?tid=9985
RE: Future plans for hardware - Djhg2000 - 07-08-2020
I'd be less interested in a beefier SoC. A64 isn't top of the line and it could do with a die shrink for better power consumption, but the performance is sufficient for doing what a phone is supposed to do.
Here's what I'd look into for the next iteration:
1. Better antennas
2. Bigger battery and/or secondary battery
3. Better microphone routing
4. Better call speaker
5. Better media speaker(s)
6. Maybe more RAM
Reasoning:
1. Due to social distancing I'm currently at a remote location where I know reception is bad, so it's the perfect testing grounds for cell reception. So far the PinePhone is struggling to perform at all on GSM (2G). I haven't tested HSPA (3G) a lot but it seems to be more or less a lost cause, cell reception is bad when it works at all, although I know we have particularly bad HSPA here.
LTE on the other hand performs reasonably well. It's not like my other phones but it's good enough to works with. LTE has the best cell coverage here by far, even though it shares bands with GSM. My guess is that the cell tower is doing something odd. I'm hoping we can enable the VoLTE capabilities of the EG25-G soon so that I can have good reception again.
2. This is in the works of being solved for the current iteration by means of making the battery thicker. I'd say we can go way thicker for the odd use cases, but since the battery doesn't have the same shape as the frame it would either look weird or not use the internal space very efficiently. I'm fine with it looking weird (and having another edge on the back to hold on to with the pinkie would be awesome) but I would investigate using a second battery with a different shape (larger area) that sits in top of the first battery when you take the back cover off.
That way you can hot swap it with another battery and you can use an external charger with cooling to prolong the life of the secondary batteries. This also enables us to run the primary battery at lower apparent capacity, keeping it in the 20-80% charge level range. This should significantly increase the life span of the primary battery and in emergencies you could activate those last 20% to make a 911/112/999/119 call. We could even keep the J7 battery (using a common battery was a great idea) and use another common battery for the secondary. This has the added benefit that when the J7 battery eventually ceases production we could still get off the shelves batteries for the secondary to keep the phones alive while we find another model for the primary (or vice versa if we're unlucky with the secondary).
As far as I know this concept hasn't really been tried on any other consumer device than business targeted laptops. There was a phone with a really small battery just for hot swapping but you couldn't use it that way. With the pogo pins this could probably be implemented on the current PinePhone.
3. From what I've heard from others there's a lot of radio interference on the microphone. Fixing this could be as easy as using a slightly different ribbon cable design or require more extensive work on the bottom board. Microphones are hard to get right and especially so with long analog signal paths.
4. The call speaker lacks clarity and amplitude. A lot of it could be mitigated in software with some equalization, but the better the hardware the better the end result. If we decide to use dual front speakers in the future we could just use one of those and bump the amplitude way up together with the frequency response. This also leaves a lot of headroom for equalization.
5. This ties in with the previous point; one front facing speaker at each end of the front would improve sound a lot. Rear facing speakers are hard to get right because you need to work with reflections to get decent amplitude and frequency response.
6. 2GB is plenty for normal use and there's always swap to cover edge cases but more RAM seems to be frequently requested and would come in handy when convergence starts working properly.
As you can see there's plenty of cool things to be done without changing the SoC. Sometimes it's the things you don't see on the spec sheet that makes a phone good.
Edit: I forgot to say I like your idea of a secondary USB port (which is something the Pyra Handheld will have). I don't know how we would fit it on there or even interface it with the A64 but it's still a good idea.
RE: Future plans for hardware - chris_02 - 07-08-2020
(07-08-2020, 09:01 AM)Djhg2000 Wrote: when the J7 battery eventually ceases production
can you confirm that we can replace the current battery with a J7?
RE: Future plans for hardware - Djhg2000 - 07-08-2020
(07-08-2020, 12:04 PM)chris_02 Wrote:(07-08-2020, 09:01 AM)Djhg2000 Wrote: when the J7 battery eventually ceases production
can you confirm that we can replace the current battery with a J7?
Well the battery was intentionally specified to match those of the Samsung J7 as discussed here: https://forums.ubports.com/topic/2403/pinephone/123 .
While I can't personally confirm it fits, @Luke can and has confirmed the 2015 J7 battery fits: https://forum.pine64.org/showthread.php?tid=8120&pid=53307#pid53307 .
RE: Future plans for hardware - bcnaz - 07-08-2020
You do need the specific/exact part number, there are different models and sizes that fall into the general 'J7' designation.
RE: Future plans for hardware - markchang - 07-18-2020
Hi i am new to pine phone,
Just a curious question
Is it possible with a pinephone pro / pinphone plus with RK3399 for more opencl / opengl support?
RE: Future plans for hardware - brb78 - 07-18-2020
I had to shave about 1 mm of casing off a Samsung OEM J7... It works.
RE: Future plans for hardware - wibble - 07-19-2020
(07-18-2020, 01:21 AM)markchang Wrote: Hi i am new to pine phone,When this was last asked, the explanation was that it was impractical for a phone - the power usage is too high which makes it difficult to dissipate the heat, and leads to a significantly shorter battery life.
Just a curious question
Is it possible with a pinephone pro / pinphone plus with RK3399 for more opencl / opengl support?
RE: Future plans for hardware - leibide - 07-24-2020
Yes, the hardware is quite old. That’s OK with me though. I think the chip manufacturer has promised ten years of support, so still five more years. I don’t really use a smartphone like a computer myself. Besides, I continue to use an Android phone. Actually, my Braveheart never worked out for me – GSM reception was very weak and even when I had a good signal, there was so much interference that my voice could not be heard on telephone calls. Then the modem stopped working so that’s the end of that for the time being.
I wholly agree with the points made by Djhg2000. I think the little things can be improved and I am confident that they will be. Already USB issues have been addressed with the revised motherboard. The Postmarket edition looks very attractive. If there is, as would seem to be the case, a problem with microphone interference, and if this could be tweaked in future then that would already be great. I don’t know how widespread the problem with dead modems is, but if this is just a firmware corruption after power was cut, then maybe a fix for this could be found too. Then maybe if the GSM reception could be improved with a new antenna printout on the internal frame I would personally be very content with the Pinephone for several years to come. Djhg2000 also mentions battery life. I gather from June update that Pine is looking into ways to improve this. Personally I just want one or more spare batteries of the same size, but the idea of a hot-swap battery is interesting. I presume the second battery would need to be bigger in order to power the first battery, and it would supply 5V to the smaller battery. The conservative charge range for the first battery is a super idea. Each end user could maybe improve the health of the original battery further by isolating it from heat build up. Mine gets quite warm. Maybe some thermal paste between the SOC and the metal plate, and perhaps also between the metal plate and the screen would help with getting the heat away. Maybe some risers on the battery would further isolate it from the metal plate. Some adhesive tape near the corners might do the trick. The main thing I would like when the Pinephone is eventually replaced with a newer version, is a way to swap out SIM cards and SD cards without removing the battery. This is because I will probably continue to use an old Android phone as well as any future Pinephone for some things only on Google Play. The old clasp fixation one used to find in mobile phones would be my personal preference, but maybe this would take up room where the WiFi antenna goes. Oh, and I don’t care about WiFi in a phone if money can be saved without it, but that’s just me. The next phone is sure to have USB 3.0 or higher so that will help a lot with internet in etc.
Forget my comment on a fix for the modem. I've just discovered on a different thread that is restricted only to the Braveheart edition.