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+--- Thread: Size of the user base (/showthread.php?tid=14281)
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Size of the user base - constfun - 06-26-2021
I'm considering investing some time into the platform and wonder how many devices have been sold? If this information is not public, a range would be very helpful to know. Thank you!
RE: Size of the user base - 33YN2 - 06-26-2021
It's not a publicly known figure anymore. But it's probably well over 30,000 units by now, which while not a lot, is considerable for a niche product at least imo.
RE: Size of the user base - constfun - 07-11-2021
Thank you for the information, much appreciated.
RE: Size of the user base - TRS-80 - 07-11-2021
From my point of view, I am not sure how useful "number of PinePhone handsets sold" is, as a metric. In fact. I wouldn't even say that the PinePhone (by itself) really is "the platform", rather the PinePhone (along with other GNU/Linux phones like Librem 5 for instance[0]) are just a couple parts of a much, much larger "platform"...
That "platform" being of course GNU/Linux itself, which is by far the most widely used "platform" in the world, in pretty much every area except PC / desktop.[1] Which is a more accurate / useful view, IMO.
We are still in very early days for sure, but there is huge and game changing upside potential here. Much excite. Very wow.
[0] As well as any others which may come along later, especially once this thing gets off the ground, now that so much ground work has been laid...
[1] And that segment is ever shrinking (as a percentage of overall devices) anyway.
RE: Size of the user base - constfun - 07-11-2021
I agree with what you're saying in regards to platform, and am also cognizant of the importance of free, as in freedom, software.
My question is rooted in doubt that the current Linux user space can ever capture the minds on mobile, having failed to do so on desktop. I'm more interested in "hardware in hands of people" and the kernel itself.
GNU/Linux is currently not a viable platform for an average person, nor an average developer. As a developer, I can't sit down and make an application that will run on any distribution out of the box. I will have to worry about many flavors of packaging and search for some lowest common denominator for all of my dependencies. In my eyes, Linux user space has failed for this reason alone.
RE: Size of the user base - Zebulon Walton - 07-11-2021
(07-11-2021, 12:28 PM)constfun Wrote: GNU/Linux is currently not a viable platform for an average person, nor an average developer. As a developer, I can't sit down and make an application that will run on any distribution out of the box. I will have to worry about many flavors of packaging and search for some lowest common denominator for all of my dependencies. In my eyes, Linux user space has failed for this reason alone.
It's not quite as as bad as all that. For a person using a home computer for general web browsing, youtube videos, and email, Linux works just fine. I've set up several that way. Flatpak and snap give some flexibility in packaging applications for differing Linux distributions.
RE: Size of the user base - constfun - 07-11-2021
(07-11-2021, 01:29 PM)Zebulon Walton Wrote: It's not quite as as bad as all that. For a person using a home computer for general web browsing, youtube videos, and email, Linux works just fine. I've set up several that way.
That is true, I do the same. Its a pretty low bar though, since "the web" is the platform in this picture.
(07-11-2021, 01:29 PM)Zebulon Walton Wrote: Flatpak and snap give some flexibility in packaging applications for differing Linux distributions.
Anecdotally, I've tried running an AppImage on Guix SD and the package did not work, failing with a missing shared library. Flatpack and snap seem to require installing something on the user's machine, perhaps some sort of runtime, before use. I'm still hopeful that one of these solutions has the magic sauce to make it all come together though.
RE: Size of the user base - TRS-80 - 07-11-2021
You make some very valid points, @constfun.
The way I've always heard it stated, it that it's the developer's job to develop the program. Your job is done when you publish a tarball. Packaging is a job for the distributions. If your program is successful / desired, (other) people will step up to help with the packaging. The distros will pick it up.
I used to think that the sheer number of different options in the greater *nix ecosystem was a problem, a negative. Confusion, fracturing, duplicated effort, etc. Eventually, I came around to see it as a positive. Lots of choices, diversity, etc. For those who want it (power users).
As regards "regular people", I don't think they really care as much. At this point I think a web browser is honestly mostly all these people need. lol And maybe email and edit some documents, view pictures, etc. Quite simple, really, and well within any number of out of the box Linux distros these days (as Zeb pointed out).
Which is the same reason why, as you correctly point out, they don't seem to care about Linux. Unless they start to have concerns about security, privacy, being in control of their data and devices. Which some more people are nowadays. Not a lot, but some. In this case there aren't really any other options.
But I guess GNU/Linux will never be all things to all people, so without knowing what you have in mind, I am not sure what else to say.
Most people get into Linux development because they have strong convictions about Free Software, or want to solve new and interesting problems, or other motivations. But you sound like you are maybe doing some sort of market survey. Maybe you want to make a living in F/LOSS? Have some app in mind? There are ways to make money, but they are different from what is common in proprietary world.
RE: Size of the user base - constfun - 07-17-2021
Quote:Most people get into Linux development because they have strong convictions about Free Software, or want to solve new and interesting problems, or other motivations. But you sound like you are maybe doing some sort of market survey. Maybe you want to make a living in F/LOSS? Have some app in mind? There are ways to make money, but they are different from what is common in proprietary world.
What's wrong with yes to all these things? There is no conflict between having strong convictions about free software, working on interesting problems, having an application idea, surveying the market, working hard, and making a living by selling things you've made.
As you've astutely pointed out, I'm very much interested in ways to make money with free (freedom) software, since, first and foremost, I have a family to support. This is why the give-it-away-for-free-then-ask-for-donations model is not interesting to me.
RE: Size of the user base - Vasant - 07-17-2021
(07-11-2021, 11:19 AM)TRS-80 Wrote: That "platform" being of course GNU/Linux itself, which is by far the most widely used "platform" in the world, in pretty much every area except PC / desktop.[1] Which is a more accurate / useful view, IMO.I am just curious if you would consider Android also as a part of the "platform". After all it does use the Linux kernel and runs on a billion+ devices. Besides that is easier to build for and deploy on Android rather than Linux which is very fragmented.